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franky's avatar

maybe best commit suicide before the year 2030 why do I still go to work if it's all over if we not collapse by running out of fossil fuels we are gonna collapse by pollution or food shortages or climate change northwestern europe will fall any moment now by amoc collapse amac is weakening very fast according tho club of rome member leon simons

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Jan Steinman's avatar

How would one obtain one of those T-shirts?

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Ugo Bardi's avatar

Look at the end of the post!

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Athanasius's avatar

I can suppose that is a misunderstanding about indicators, pyramids were built for many reasons and are linked to a time period, monumental works in Egypt begin in predynastic period with the Osireon like megalithic structures and go to the Greeks with the Pharos of Alexandria. After Kofu we have a lot of works underground with the Kingdom Valley tombs and some mayor works like the Achepsout temple and the city of Akhenaten Amarna!

The collapse of Egypt is probably at the end of the Roman Empire, we know that Rome used the Egypt as a source of grain and various other consumables and that it was weak during the Arab expansion during 6/7 Th Century.

The vitality of Egyptian culture is a different issue, we know that Pythagoras is claimed to be "instructed in Egypt" as a sign of great knowledge so we have a sure indication that the culture was considered important and dominant in 500 BC, for sure we know also that Alexander made its knowledge center in Egypt too with the Library of Alexandria and that the Greeks toke the Egyptian culture: until Roman conquest Greek royalty is shown in usual Egypt iconography, we know that they didn't change the usual system of government (metrology, scribes, census, etc) and kept all the bureaucratic apparatus in use, similar are the conquest of China where the conquerors become Chinese having their original culture overwhelmed and rewritten in Chinese therms.

I see the Egyptian Pharaonic society as a good example of integrated and renewable society, they had 5000 years of almost constant overproduction without depleting their resources, we are sure of it because they built monumental structures during all their civilization ramping up complexity until fall by external forces: monumental buildings, stone caved pottery, diffuse jewels and similar indicate a labor-intensive specialized work could only exist with an assured surplus of food.

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Philip Harris's avatar

Very good to see you both looking so fit! I’m thinking the civilisation continued upriver at Thebes for a good while? The Nile did not let them down completely. I wonder whether comparison with the global, well, something over half a global roll out of ’our’ modern energy constrained outburst might have a ‘Hubbert proxy’ in space rocketry on an even more abrupt timescale than pyramids? There are plans to achieve a vast expansion in rockets to service 'the internet of things'. And then there is further digital expansion in tandem with AI. What do you think? (Perhaps the ancient tomb cultures were an attempt at virtual reality? I attempt a smile.)

Some interesting scholarly study has emerged from some earlier writing on Egypt, a study devoted to the history of mechanised intelligence and incidentally the rocketry to go with the latest iteration. I attempted a couple of reviews of Jeremy Naydler's later books when I imperfectly set up my substack last October. My apologies that the reviews contain more of me than of the useful Naydler studies.

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Ugo Bardi's avatar

Yep! I have a post somewhere on rocketry as a proxy for the Hubbert trajectory of our civilization. I have to dig it out and update it. One of these days...

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franky's avatar

dear ugo, did you give me the wrong information first you did say that nothing would happen in the years 2025 and 2026 and now you say we will collapse first you said there was no hurry and is this the correct model above ?

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Philip Harris's avatar

Quick tangential correction. My attempt at a joke about the ancient tombs of Egypt does not do justice to Naydler's deep insights into that long civilisation's religious culture that invoked the memory of the Gods of the macrocosm to help order the microcosm that was there inheritance along the essential Nile. See his book 'The Struggle for the Human Future'. Rocketry is just one of our more careless modern assumptions.

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franky's avatar

but how exactly do you now we will not collapse in the years 2025 or 2026 i like to get my hands on the weec 2026 book of the update of the fifth element when will we collapse than and are we on the standard run scenario or the bau or bau 2 ?

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Ugo Bardi's avatar

Sorry, franky, but I had to mute you. Too many comments.

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franky's avatar

ooh sorry ugo just hope we still had a few years at least untill 2030 meant nothing by it there just to many scenario's all wit a different year

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